Understanding Sexual Desire & Finding True Freedom with Matt Cline

Transcript

Welcome to the Shameless Podcast, where I help Christian men kill shame, stand strong, and live on mission. I'm your host, Ken P, and I'm bringing you real stories, practical insights, and biblical truths that equip you to break free from your sin, shame, and live a life of purpose. Let's step out of the shadows together and into the light of Christ. What if your sexual desire wasn't something to suppress, but something to understand? What if lust was never just about the flesh, but also about something bigger within your heart?

And could the craving you're ashamed of actually be pointing you to something holy? Today's episode will challenge what you think you know about desire, temptation, and healing. And my guest is someone who doesn't just talk about behavior change. He talks about heart level transformation. If you've ever felt stuck in a cycle of sexual sin or shame, what Matt shares today could unlock something powerful for you. So today, I want to welcome Matt Klein. Matt, welcome to the show, my friend. How you doing? Thanks, Ken. Doing well.

How are I'm doing I'm doing amazing. I'm here in Nashville, Tennessee, where it's nice and warm and you're in Canada where it's not warm. So, We're just waiting for summer and it just keeps snowing. I'm like, "Oh man, when is the snow gonna go away?" I know. It's second It's second winter for you guys. It's kicking in right now. Exactly. 30 days of summer eventually. Yeah. That's awesome. Well, for uh people who don't know you, Matt, just to make sure I'm clear, right? You're the founder of Restored Ministries.

It's a global ministry where you've helped over 4,000 men find freedom sex uh from sexual addiction. And a lot of what you do is not like behavior modification. You're trying to get into the deep level of their soul and helping them focus in intimacy with Christ. Is that correct? Yeah, man. Exactly what Jesus looks at. He looks at the inner part of us and that's where we want to focus. So, yeah, you got it. Awesome, man. Well, take us back to your story and what was the moment where God began shifting your perspective on your sexual struggles.

Yeah, that's a good question. So, my story, I I never went through addiction recovery. I never went through programs. what it was for me was Jesus drew me out. And so when I learned what intimacy looked like with Christ, that really was the foundation that I needed to um sustain freedom in my life. And so that looked like getting more in the word get that looked like uh learning thankfulness in all circumstances. Looked like just changing my prayer life and having an intimacy with Christ. It wasn't so much about doing, but just about being with him and being united.

But what happened was it's pretty interesting because we look at like what does this look like to be unified with Christ number one and then secondly what is that going to bring into your life because if it's not going to do something for you as flawed human beings we're probably not going to keep pursuing this and so when I was about nine months out of pornography God started revealing things traumas in my life and bringing back memories and that process of healing my heart I I remember one morning it was about 4:15 in the morning and God woke me up and there were these three memories on my mind uh about being sexually abused as a teenager and I didn't even know that I had been abused.

And so I I remember my body started shaking and I was kind of in this state of shock and it was through intimacy with Christ that he started to reveal the things on my heart that were connected to my sin. But really even more than that he just wanted to heal my heart in general. And so that's my story of Jesus drawing me out both of sin and also of healing the heart things in my life that were holding me back really from receiving the love of God uh in my life.

Yeah. When he started drawing you out, were there times where you were kind of like pushing back and you're like, "No, no, no, no. I don't want to go there. Let's go over here." You know, I remember one time I masturbated and the next morning I felt like the Lord said, "Hey, call this one guy." And I was like, "No, not going to do it." And I didn't. And that was not good because it led to more and more and more destruction, which ultimately led to people being hurt.

And it just wasn't good. And so, yeah, certainly there were times where I chose pleasure over praise. I chose fearing people, fearing confession over fearing God. But I remember it was so clear one time reading in the Bible where it said, "Crucify the desires of your flesh." And I was reading this and I'm like, "Oh, interesting." Like it doesn't say when you're emotionally healthy, it says crucify the desires of your flesh. And so like if it is not dependent on our emotional health and on healing all of our traumas and our wounds and the rejection issues and father wounds and all of this like if God is saying all the time to crucify the desires of our flesh then how cool is that that through being unified with the Holy Spirit that I can overcome and have the power to crucify even when I have emotional wounds and things in my life, insecurities and stuff like that.

So to me it was a really big revelation of my identity in Christ that even when I have various things that I'm going through he goes no you're still more than a conqueror be unified with me and you can put these things to death and that really is what happened. So yeah there were c certainly resistance but all the resistance is when I either felt inadequate or I wanted the pleasure but the submission came when I focused more on him and his power in my life rather than the things that I was focused on myself.

Yeah, it's fascinating how there is this correlation between our behavior modifications, right? Or even just the willpower that we try to do things and try to get freedom on our own when God is like there's actually a way better and easier path and that's to lay down our lives and be submitted to him and letting the Holy Spirit's power work through us. That's what I'm hearing you say. It's like this is what I ultimately did was to lay down my life and lay down my desires.

But I I have noticed that many men have a hard time doing that. Why do you think that is? I I I'll give a very flat answer. I think it's because we don't know how to come alive in our relationship with Jesus. And maybe some people listening are like, "Oh, I've been in church my whole life and I've been a Christian and I've heard this stuff and that doesn't work for me." And I would just suggest to you that there's a level of intimacy with Christ that is so profound that a lot of people, like probably 90 plus% of people in the church, don't understand.

and it's foreign to them. And even for me, like there's more that I don't understand and that I haven't experienced. But to continue pursuing Jesus is so powerful. So in Colossians 3, it says to it says that you are dead. You are dead. Like spiritually speaking, it says we are dead because we were died with Christ or we died. We were put to death with the death of Jesus. Then it says Christ is our life. So we are alive in Christ. So first we're dead, then we're alive in Christ.

And then it says, "Put to death therefore the things of the flesh." And sexual immorality is listed there. So what do we try to do? We try to hold on to our pleasure and we try to hold on to our comfort and hold on to control while knowing in our head that we should put things to death, that we should quit certain behaviors, quit certain sins. There's addictions we want to get out of our life. If we try to quit these things without first going, what does it actually look like to be dead to myself and to be alive in Christ?

Because if we're not fully close with him, intimate with him, and doing it in a Jesus- centered way, all it is behavior modification, and we're going to lose the battle every single time. And that's why people go for years and decades trying to heal wounds and trying to quit behaviors and trying to change what they're doing and quit addictions, but never focusing on the intimacy with Christ. And then ultimately feeling like, oh, I'm not good enough. I've tried this. Maybe it works for other people. And then we take on even more shame and feel more defeated.

And this cycle is so damaging. So I think it's so important for us to understand the difference between simply changing behavior and then doing it in a Jesus- centered way. Yeah. So walk us through that Jesus centered way. Cuz when you talk about intimacy, the reality is most guys when they think about intimacy, they just think sex, right? That's the PC word in Christian world. When you're like preaching from a pulpit of how you want to use the word sex is intimacy. But you're using it in a different way where it's like intimacy with Christ looks so much more profound, so much deeper than just sex.

Well, and sex points to it. Sex points in such a profound way. So in Genesis 4:1 is the very first thing that happens in a broken world. So Adam and Eve get kicked out of the garden. It says, "Adam knew his wife Eve. They make love." And so the very first thing that happened was they had sex. And God's on a prude, right? Like he names it and just says what they did. And I love it. But that word new is yada in the Hebrew. It's y a d- a yada.

So Adam yada his his wife Eve. And so sexual intercourse is a picture of this deep knowing. And in fact, it's the pinnacle of of human intimacy. And so then when we look at what scripture says about our intimacy with Jesus, it's the same thing. Like Jesus says, "This is eternal life that you know the father." It's that word yada. It's this picture that sex can give us about what a greater covenant looks like. Jesus says in scripture where people are like, "Hey, I've done all of these things.

Now I should go into heaven thinking works based." And he's going, "Yeah, but get away from me. I never knew you." It's this, "I never knew you." Had this intimate knowing between you and me that sex can point to. And so this intimacy is so important. And so if you think about like that statement is profound. This is eternal life that you would know the father. That's an intimacy that is so important in our life. Now, what is the enemy's plan for our life? Our spiritual enemy says, "I want nothing more than to separate you from the father." And so, what is the pinnacle on this earth?

What intimacy looks like? It's sexual intercourse between a man and a woman in marriage. Sexual uh intercourse represents physical, emotional, and spiritual unity. And so, sex has so much power. what we have or what we do with our bodies has so much power in relation to our spiritual oneness with Christ. No wonder then there's so much perversion and counterfeit sexuality in this world because the enemy wants us to know nothing about what true intimacy looks like. And so intimacy is not simply sex. Sexual intimacy should be the pinnacle of what true intimacy looks like when there's spiritual, emotional, relational intimacy in marriage.

and then that consummates it. But intimacy with the Lord is not a sexual thing. In fact, sex just points to a greater covenant and a greater intimacy that we can have where we simply just walk as one. We walk knowing that we are the righteousness of Christ as it says and we know how to abide in him and delight ourselves in him and he is in us. And that word in is just everywhere in scripture just like a husband enters into the bride. You know what's fascinating that I found for most men is that struggle with it.

They love sex. They love the the endorphins, right? The ecstasy that comes from it. And I always tell them, do you guys realize that that is a shadow of what the Lord wants to give you? Like he's the substance, right? So like no matter how good things are in this world, it's just a shadow of what's to come, right? And that's where like the beautiful intimacy like truly being known by God that he knows you and you know him. I think it's in Galatians where he says not that you know me it's that he knows you.

Right. Yeah. Or the way Paul says it. And I'm just always fascinated about that. Like oh man God knows me. And because he knows me I can now just freely go to him and just share like here's everything that's going on in my life. And it's not not that superficial knowing right where it's just like oh yeah I know this is where you work. is like, "No, no, I know every facet about you. I know every hair in your head, right? Like, I know the day you're going to die." Like, he knows all those things.

And, uh, it gives me freedom to pursue God. But one thing, Matt, that you you kind of implied is that sex, right, it it points us to Christ. And sex is one of our desires. But uh something that you and I were talking about a while back was that like desire that sexual desire has a purpose and it's to point us to God. Can you unpack a little bit more on how Gaia is end up taking that sexual desire and distorting it to not go to God but go to other things?

Yeah. Like we we think in life and we read scripture through the lens of works basically. And so you were talking about behavior change earlier. Like we see these instructions in scripture and we think oh I need to do this thing and it's all about behavior. What Christ says is he's like it's actually about your heart and about being unified with me. And so one example would be flee sexual immorality. This is 1 Corinthians 6. And so flee sexual immorality. So what do a lot of us do?

A lot of us we hear this command and we're like okay I if I'm tempted in my bedroom I got to leave my phone. I got to go for a run. I got to do push-ups. I got to call accountability. do whatever I can physically in terms of my works to flee sexual immorality. But if you see that instruction or that verse through the lens of a spiritual covenant in Christ, then you know that he doesn't just look at the works or the outside of a person.

He looks at the inner man. And so second Timothy 2:22 says you this is like pursue the reality that you are the righteousness of God. Pursue righteous living. pursue growing in faith, growing in love, pursue receiving his peace in that moment. That's an internal, it's speaking to an internal condition in our hearts that God can come and fulfill and satisfy. And so our sexual desire, flee sexual immorality, actually can lead us right to the arms of Jesus where we can experience righteousness, faith, love, peace. So when we look at it through a workspace perspective, I look at scripture and life through that way, it's so destructive and actually exhausting.

But when guys learn this new way of inviting Jesus into the center of their sexuality, man, the way that we fight is just different. Like we can have this this delightful relationship with Jesus that grows in the context of our sexuality. So the way that it to simplify it in a maybe different way is in terms of what does this look like for us to have sexuality point to Jesus. I used to think like my body is physical or I would believe the lie that we have sexual needs.

And so I'm like man I got this physical desire these sexual needs in my body and God's not physical. So how the heck can he come and satisfy that? That doesn't make any sense to me. But when I read when I then read 1 Corinthians 6, it says that just as by the power of God, Jesus was raised from the dead and our bodies are members of Christ himself. I'm like, "Oh, so by the power of God, a physical body was raised from the dead. Surely he can then get me through a moment of temptation even though he's not physical." So we need to look beneath the surface and go, "Okay, this is not just a physical desire that I have.

It's actually on a heart level revealing something in me that God wants to come and heal and satisfy. So here's a story is one time I was in the midst of temptation and considering going to porn and I just sensed pretty clearly God say to me, you want to be sexually desired right now. And I was like, oh wow. Like I thought my desire was to see naked people having sex. Like I thought that's what my desire was. And if you ask most people hooked on porn, that's what they'll tell you.

But really on a heart level, my desire was to be sexually desired. And so I could then take that and start praising God and saying, "God, thank you so much that you desire me and you desire me so much that you sent your son to die for me on the cross and pay the highest price." I start praising him for his ability and his desire to satisfy my heart's desire. So Psalm 37:4 says, "Delight yourself in the Lord." That's that word in. You're in him. Delight yourself in the Lord.

He will give you the desires of your heart. So every time that we have a sexual desire or an urge, it can point to the Lord actually satisfying us on a heart level, which then brings peace to the body and we don't need to go to sin anymore. man, what are those maybe desire manifestations, right, or triggers that you might say like, oh, these are actually things that are trying to tell you, hey, come to God, right? Like you were saying, I felt like I wanted to be wanted, right?

That was one of the triggers. Are there any other triggers that you have noticed men have or patterns that men have that you're like, oh, if you see this, this is a direct correlation to go to God. Yeah, man. Any trigger, any trigger that it is, it could be a trigger. It could be a visual trigger. Man, it's so important that guys know scripture. Like, this is the whole thing that I kind of battle against with our with a lot of the people that we work with is guys are like, "I've been in recovery for six years or 20 years or 30 years.

I've been in recovery. I just can't shake it because we're relying on emotional healing being the thing to quit sin. And once I've healed all of my trauma, then I'll be able to quit." But scripture doesn't say slowly back away from sin as you heal things. It's like no crucify it. So that that it has to be a mindset shift to go to oh what does this look like for Christ actually to be central and to be satisfactory in my life. And so with the triggers what it can look like is you know scripture you know in Romans 1 in various places it talks about we worship the created being rather than the creator.

Okay. So, what's then the clue here? It says in that Romans 1, you exchange the truth of God for a lie and then he turns us over to dishonorable behavior with our bodies. And so, if we know that we exchange the truth of God for a lie and we worship the created being rather than the creator, then what's the truth? Every time there's a visual trigger, I can go just like you just said, I was like, "Oh, that's just a glimmer of the beauty that you are, Father.

Man, you are so much more beautiful. open my eyes to seeing your beauty in a new way. And then we can pray for that person. Remember, flee and flee and pursue love. So pray for that person. Thank you so much, God, that you put them on my path and I get to pray for them right now. And so whatever the trigger is can point you to Christ. And then on an emotional level, think about whatever you're trying to numb out. So guys will try to numb out the feeling of insignificance, of disrespect, of rejection, feeling alone.

So what's the inverse of that? If you're alone, maybe you really want connection. If you're rejected, maybe you really want intimacy. If you're feeling insignificant like I did, maybe you just want to know that you're significant. And so that points to the longing on your heart. Too often the language about quitting porn is, hey, know your triggers and know how to kind of get them out of your life. Know how to manage your triggers. But what would happen if you actually looked at the trigger highlighting the desire that your heart has then all of a sudden, okay, I feel rejected right now.

That means I'm desiring maybe respect or connection, whatever it is. Thank you so much, Lord, that you respect me so much and that you value my words and that you pursue me no matter what and you are closer than a brother and you literally just praised him and you thank him for the truth that he can bring into your life. All of a sudden, triggers are like not even a big deal anymore. And in fact, it's something that's really good because it leads to greater satisfaction and peace that the Lord can give you.

Yeah, man. Matt, I remember a time when I was going through my recovery and I've been free from it now for over 16 17 years now. Like it's been quite a it's been quite some time now that I don't remember the exact date, right? But I remember when I was struggling, I had that feeling when I realized that most of my triggers were either stress or loneliness. Like when I felt lonely, I didn't know what to do. And I'm an extrovert, right? So I was like, let's go hang out with people.

Let's go find someone to talk. you know, but it was behavior modification because even I was hanging out with believers, right? When I was alone, all of a sudden the temptation came back, right? And it wasn't until I got to that place where I was like, "Wait a minute, there's a deeper longing here for connection that humans can't satisfy." God designed us to be with humans, but there was something much more deeper where Christ was saying, "Hey, come into the deeper waters with me, right? come enjoy the Holy Spirit in a in a way that you've never encountered me before.

And I'm like, "Oh my gosh, this is scary and it's hard, right? Cuz I'm someone who likes boundaries. I kind of like to know where I'm going." And he's like, "No, no, no. You're going to we're going to go through seasons of life that like you're just going to have to hold on tight, buckle up. Uh but it's going to be the most beautiful and dependent spirit-ledd life that you're gonna enjoy." Hello. But man, when I started doing that, it's kind of like, oh, when I felt that loneliness, it was like this is me.

My heart actually telling me I haven't been intimate with God. Love it. I've been trying to do it with other things. So now I'm like, okay, let's grab my Bible. Let's pray for a few minutes. Let's just reconnect and like, okay, Lord, I am reminded that I am in you. You are in me. Like, we are completely united in Christ. This is a beautiful truth. I love that you keep going back to that because it's it's the foundation, right? Without that, we miss the whole thing and we end up being in works based, you know, Christianity versus a grace-based mentality.

Exactly. So, I love where you're going with that, man. And so, Matt, as men are listening to us, just talk about this, and I think you and I could talk about this for hours, right? You keep pointing them back to scripture, but I know that there are men who are listening to this and they just feel stuck in shame or secrecy right now. as we wrap up, what what would you want him to hear before we end? Well, every literally every event we go to where we do assessments, over 50% of the men have sexual shame over their sexual past and have secrets, sexual secrets that they've never told anybody.

And every event that we've ever done it, done these assessments, it's over half the people. I think those two things go hand in hand together. You were talking about this beautiful relationship with the father where you can just be open with him about everything. Like Hebrews 4 says, everything is laid bare before him. Everything's already exposed. He already knows. If you're struggling with samesex attraction or you're struggling with tendencies to beastiality or you have different things that are just so perverted, maybe the fantasies that you have are violent.

Maybe it's just normal, but you think you're going to feel judged. Whatever it is that you just feel like, I can never tell anybody this. I just want you to know like God only sees that as a hindrance to you receiving his love. And he is desperate for you to get that out so that you can receive his love. And I used to say when I came out of sin, like, yeah, God had to deal with me. And I felt like one day the Lord just said to me, I wasn't dealing with you, Matt.

I was loving you. I was rescuing you. And I remember this man was meeting with me and he said to me, "Hey, what do you want to talk about today?" And I said, 'I don't I don't really know. It was kind of an accountability relationship. And so he said, "Well, why don't you ask the Lord what he wants to say to you?" And so I just took a moment. I literally just closed my eyes and said, "God, do you want to say anything to me?" And I listened.

And I saw this bowl in my mind's eye. I saw this picture of a bowl and I saw this hand scoop out this bowl, except there was nothing in it. I had gotten rid of all of my secrets. I let out all of my shame. Not just like, hey, I watched porn and hid it. I masturbated and hid it. But it was like this was my fantasy life. This was what I struggled with. These were the longings that that I had in terms of, you know, my young adult years.

And I thought that I missed out on sexual experiences and all of these thoughts and these fantasies that I had, I got it all out. And so I see this hand and God's essentially showing me, hey, your soul is clean. Like you have repented. you've confessed is great. And I said to the Lord, that's great, but I don't feel clean. And I remember clearly he said, I know you don't, but the more you confess and the more you share your story, the more you're going to get healed.

And so scripture says like through repentance, we're made right, but it's through confessing to one another that we and praying for each other that we get healing. And so I want to encourage you that there is such a safety in the presence of God that you can bring anything to him. And then secondly, he will also bring people into your life that are not going to judge you, going to shame you, but they're going to love you. They're going to show empathy. They're going to sympathize with you.

And you will notice when you start, if you're feeling hopeless right now, when you start even sharing just a little bit of your story, people are going to start opening up to you because they trust you. and vulnerability leadership. And you're going to see so much purpose that God is going to be bringing into your life in this area of sexual brokenness because he doesn't just see you as someone who's broken and too far gone, but he's like, "No, I can use this and I can use this person to impact other people." So, if you're hopeless, I get it.

I just want to encourage you to first seek the father because there's such a safety there. Get in the scriptures and ha ask the Holy Spirit to illuminate things to you and then really pray and believe that he's going to send people to you that are safe and and and there's hope and you can get free. Ken, you've been free a long time. I haven't been free as long as you have, but I'm free of it. Like there's no temptation like not even a thing in my life.

But there were years where I couldn't even fathom that being the case. And so really a freedom that's available. You know, Matt, it's crazy to think though, like I know when I say like, "Oh, it's been 15, 16 years." But there are times when I'm like, "Man, I felt like it was just yesterday." You know, you think about it because when you've been in such deep darkness in shame, it kind of gripped you for so long. Yeah. And I remember like I'll feel shame about some other stuff that I do, right?

Like say if I fail at work at something, I tell people all the time, I'm a recovering perfectionist, right? If I fail, I feel like if I fail at something, I feel like I'm a failure. It's something I'm working through, right? But that same shame can sometimes trigger my other shame. Like, oh, do you remember how you had all this sexual sin? And I'm like, well, that's the enemy coming in. I rebuke you in the name of Jesus, right? Like, take that aside. I'm like, no, I'm clean.

But man, for those men who are hearing this, I want you to like, if you need to pause this, rewind, not like a cassette tape because most of them don't know what that is, right? But like listen to those beautiful truths that Matt just said because it's it's so inspiring to know that like confession with one another is going to be huge. Being made right with God huge. Knowing your identity so pivotal because it's just going to give you this heart of like I can do this right and uh man I don't know if you have a community you have a community right?

Yeah it's called Pure Freedom Community. So it's purefc.ca is the website. It's for men over 18. Totally free to join. Great. So, if you guys want, you can check out Matt's community. I have a community as well. Join both communities, right? There's going to be great people. Like, what you want to do is be around men who are not just struggling, but also godly men who can help you through this, right? So, like, if Matt, you have a community, I I want all these people to go over there, check it out, right?

It's free. It's going to be beautiful to just be around men who are constantly feeding you the word and reminding you of your identity and from a grace-based perspective and not works based because that's what what you're going to need. Matt, as we wrap up here, man, do you have any final words uh or encouragement for people? Yeah, man. You just talked about identity, which is one of my favorite things, and I just want to encourage people with that that know your identity. You could ask, you could you literally just go to God in prayer.

Say, "What do you say about me?" You could go to the scriptures and say, "What does the Bible say about me?" This is this is the deal. We think that we struggle with temptations with with sexual temptations. We don't struggle with that nearly as much as we struggle with knowing our identity. So, Adam and Eve are made in the image and the likeness of God. What is the first thing Satan does? He goes, "Hey, if you eat this thing, then you will be like God." Totally forgetting their identity.

What does the father say to Jesus? This is my son with whom I'm well pleased. What's the very first words of the first temptation to Jesus? If you are the son of God. And so we think the temptation was turning stones to bread because he's fasting and hungry. We think the temptation is a sexual sin. Actually, the temptation is, hey, I want to tempt this person to forget who God says they are. Man, when you know who God says you are, it is amazing. It's an amazing truth to live in.

And then we struggle with it because it's not common sense and it's not logical. It actually doesn't even make any sense. Like Colossians 1:22, because of the cross of Christ, he considers us pure and blamely and or blameless and above reproach and holy. Like what? But that's what he says about us. So I want to encourage you listeners, if you're feeling discouraged, what does God say about you? That is a rock solid truth. And even when we're in sin, he never comes and calls us an addict.

He comes and he says, "Hey, this is who you are. You are my beloved child." And so get rooted in the word and get rooted in your identity and pursue intimacy with Jesus. It's going to transform your whole life. Matt, that was like a massive truth bomb. Like I just want people to hear that. Like even just thinking about Jesus, right? When he felt like that's huge, right? Like uh when you were talking about God when he first spoke to him, like he's my son when I'm well pleased.

when he goes into the wilderness, it's like, oh my gosh, you're right. Like, it's always a temptation to forget your identity. I think uh Paul Trip says it best where he was like, it's identity amnesia that we struggle with, right? Uh Matt, for those of people who are like, I love how you're spitting truth and they want to get to know you more, whether it's within your community or just um talk to you, what what or free resources, what's the best place they can reach out to you?

Everything's at the website. Restored Ministries.ca CA is the website. So there's events, there's courses, uh just starting a YouTube channel. Had a podcast for four years. We had a big global audience and the Lord led me out of that, but uh and I miss it. Miss my buddy that I would co-host with, but now we're doing YouTube. So that's on the website. And then there's courses, courses and group coaching, one-on-one coaching. So if you want to get any personal coaching, even marriage coaching, feel free to book a call on the website and we'll help you out.

Yeah, a lot of resources there. So, restored ministries.ca. I love it, Matt. Thank you so much for being a part of the Shameless Podcast. Thank you so much for helping so many men be free. And I love it that you're just focused on intimacy, crucifying the flesh, and making sure people walk in their identity. So, for those of you who are listening, I implore you, go to check out Matt Klein's website, restore ministries.ca. It's all on the show notes. And as we wrap up here, I just want to remind you like, hey, your desire was first created by God.

and distorted by the fall. But the beautiful part of the gospel is that it renewed your desires. And these God-given desires are meant to lead you to the one who could actually satisfy your soul. So don't settle for the shadow, right? Go to the substance Jesus. Pursue intimacy. And if this conversation is stirring something in you, take the next steps towards healing and wholeness today. Find someone you can connect with. Get the healing you need. And remember to kill shame, stand strong, and be on mission.

Hope you guys have a great day and God bless. Thanks for joining us today. If you found this episode helpful, make sure to subscribe and leave a review. Remember, killing shame isn't just about breaking free from the past. It's about walking boldly into the future God has for you.